Excited
For those of us growing up in the U.S. with immigrant parents in the seventies and eighties, there was no getting around the fact that the term F.O.B. (Fresh Off the Boat – pronounced letter “F”, letter “O”, letter “B”) was meant to be derogatory, when applied to ourselves, or to our parents. I had no idea, the term has changed in recent times to “fob” (rhymes with rob) and used affectionately as “fobby”. Jeff Yang tackles this topic in a recent article for SFGate. Specifically he writes about two websites, that have gotten a lot of attention in Asian circles, mymomisafob.com and mydadisafob.com. I’ve actually seen the first site, and read through many funny entries.
Yang calls our attention to these sites, not only because they are funny, but because there’s something endearing about them for those of us that have immigrant parents. We love our parents and all their funny quips and sayings. As I said earlier, for those of us of certain age, we’d never actually call them F.O.B., so Yang wanted to know why Teresa Wu and Serena Wu (not related, but creators of the two respective sites), included the “fob” in the title of their websites. It turns out they used the term as “fob”, not “F.O.B.” and referred to their parents as “fobby” in the most endearing way possible. Yang gets some help from another Yang, Gene Yang, to get the explanation for this cultural shift:
[Gene] Yang, who now resides in Fremont, notes that Mission San Jose, the high school Teresa and Serena attended, has one of the most Asian student populations in the nation. “It’s like 80 percent Asian,” he says. “The average SAT scores there are through the roof, and they have no football team, but an absolutely killer badminton team.”
It makes sense that kids growing up in an environment where being Asian is the norm would have a different view of being an immigrant than one where they’re in the minority. “If everyone has immigrant parents, it’s easy to go, ‘Oh, my parents are such fobs’ and feel affectionate toward them, even proud of them,” he says.
I’m not sure I’ll ever be able to wrap my head around calling my own parents “fobby”, but they definitely had their share of “fobby” moments. When my parents bought their first new car ever in 1973, they bought vinyl seat covers to go over the vinyl factory seats. They finally took the seat covers off 13 years later to sell the car. By then the rest of the car was rusted out from too many New York winters, but the seats still looked brand new. I was able to convince my parents in later life that should enjoy the velour in their new car in 1997, rather than wrap the car seats with seat covers, so the next owner could enjoy the seats. I’m curious if anyone else actually uses “fob” and “fobby” endearingly, or do you also think of “F.O.B.” as a derogatory term?
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Growing up in the mainland, I actually haven't heard of that word until...I was fourteen when I was using l33tspeak to my friend and they started calling me 'fob.' No idea what that meant, urbandictionary only explained half of it. That raises another question, why associate that with fob? Asian gamers aren't the only ones using that....
Anyways, I personally don't find it offensive. Not when a fellow Asian calls me that. If some white person does, it's just plain weird...and I would interpret it as though they were being condescending, because from my experiences, they usually are (Chinese this, Chinese that, Chinese etc.).
Also, from my experiences in mainland/Singapore/etc., if you talk in a funky Mandarin accent people start looking at you weird, lol....reverse fobbiness? XD
Growing up in the mainland, I actually haven't heard of that word until...I was fourteen when I was using l33tspeak to my friend and they started calling me 'fob.' No idea what that meant, urbandictionary only explained half of it. That raises another question, why associate that with fob? Asian gamers aren't the only ones using that....
Anyways, I personally don't find it offensive. Not when a fellow Asian calls me that. If some white person does, it's just plain weird...and I would interpret it as though they were being condescending, because from my experiences, they usually are (Chinese this, Chinese that, Chinese etc.).
Also, from my experiences in mainland/Singapore/etc., if you talk in a funky Mandarin accent people start looking at you weird, lol....reverse fobbiness? XD
I intended it to be chink. cunt works too though. just to you know, clarify after 10 or so days.
I intended it to be chink. cunt works too though. just to you know, clarify after 10 or so days.
Touche.
Actually, I'm pretty certain the C-word is "cunt."
I think coming from Kevin's perspective, it's totally understandable how the term "F.O.B" or "FOB" is offensive. I can also understand Lac's comparison to the N-Word, but also with Kevin's explanation it also makes it different. The term "F.O.B" or "FOB" even though used by many Asian-Americans today, is not exclusive to just Asians. I think a better comparison to the history and usage of the "N-Word" would be how Filipino-Americans use the term "FLIP".
In terms of Mexicans, people may not be using the term FOB on them or between each other, but there are similar terms that are either derogatory or just used as slang. Ernie, please delete this if you think it's unacceptable. However, two examples of those would be "Wetback" and "Pisa".
Also the "C-Word" he is referring to is Chink.
I think the main problem with this is the usage of the term may change over time, unknowingly or purposely. I have a Uncle-in-law of German descent and he would tell me how his family used to be labeled as "F.O.B.s" as well.
Nowadays, in my experience I'm more likely to hear it from Asian-Americans. Whether it's used as a derogatory term or a term of endearment is subjective. It's not the first time people unknowingly used a derogatory slang term and then pass it on as something "positive". It seems like a bunch of terms used nowadays, are used more frequently because people either don't know the history or just pass it off as "well I didn't mean to offend anybody" way and I'm just using it because my friends are using it.
Depends on who blogs about the city council meeting. Hey-yo!
Do you think people would get mad if I opened a bar called FOB?
Touche.
Actually, I'm pretty certain the C-word is "cunt."
I think coming from Kevin's perspective, it's totally understandable how the term "F.O.B" or "FOB" is offensive. I can also understand Lac's comparison to the N-Word, but also with Kevin's explanation it also makes it different. The term "F.O.B" or "FOB" even though used by many Asian-Americans today, is not exclusive to just Asians. I think a better comparison to the history and usage of the "N-Word" would be how Filipino-Americans use the term "FLIP".
In terms of Mexicans, people may not be using the term FOB on them or between each other, but there are similar terms that are either derogatory or just used as slang. Ernie, please delete this if you think it's unacceptable. However, two examples of those would be "Wetback" and "Pisa".
Also the "C-Word" he is referring to is Chink.
I think the main problem with this is the usage of the term may change over time, unknowingly or purposely. I have a Uncle-in-law of German descent and he would how his family used to be labeled as "F.O.B.s" as well.
Nowadays, in my experience I'm more likely to hear it from Asian-Americans. Whether it's used as a derogatory term or a term of endearment is subjective. It's not the first time people use a slang term and then pass it on as something "positive". It seems like a bunch of terms used nowadays, are used more frequently because people either don't know the history or just pass it off as "well I didn't mean to offend anybody" way and I'm just using it because my friends are using it.
Depends on who blogs about the city council meeting. Hey-yo!
Do you think people would get mad if I opened a bar called FOB?
I might be a bit younger than a lot of people here as a sophomore in college, but to be honest, I can't even remember the last time my friends or myself have used "fob" in an actual derogatory manner. Being a Filipino born an raised in America, it's always been used in a joking manner like, "Damn dude, that was hella fob!" if you end up unintentionally doing something our parents would normally do.
I do however work with a bunch of Filipino immigrants at my job, and one time I said "fob" in the same context as I normally would with my friends, and I actually did offend her, which surprised me. She's also around my age too, but I realized that since she has a thicker accent than most, she must have actually gotten that phrase thrown at her in a derogatory way in high school... whereas between my friends and most Filipino teenagers are hardly ever serious calling each other fobs.
I don't think I've ever used the term F.O.B. either.. it has always been known to me as fob.
I'll add another FOB concept for you. If anyone has had to ship an item, there is term called "Freight On Board" or FOB. It's a shipping term and you have to specify FOB Shipper or FOB Buyer for the transportation costs. The first time the mail room person asked me "FOB to you" or "FOB to X," I said "I was born here" which totally confused her until I explained. Now, she smiles whenever I have an export package because she knows what I want to say.
Pronouncing the letters makes sense and amongst us Asians, it is a term of endearment and commonality of experience. Also saying "fob" sounds like a remote keyless entry device.
Wow thanks for this article. I wasn't fully aware of the origins of the word fob. My friends and I see it as a term of endearment, and even used the word for our blog, www.absolutelyfobulous.com. I was born and raised in Asia, and came to the States for college, and I have never taken offense at that word. It's a common thing for my friends and I to poke fun of our fobbiness.
Got it.
Err. not by a literal boat but yes I was born in Taiwan and moved to the United States. I am not so much apathetic to the term, just seen, on a personal level, the evolution of the word.
Kevin, did you actually came here by boat? Then of course you're apathetic towards the term. The level of apathy can also be generational.
So honestly, context is key (like, oh, every other "____ offends me" post on 8Asians) and, nope, it doesn't really get on my nerves. Then again, "geisha" doesn't get on my nerves either, and that got us in a "blog war," note usage of air quotes.
Being hated on by Asian feminists blogs AND urb4n. Can't win em all. Or any.
what's the "c-word"? I've never heard people referring to Mexican, Italian, Armenian, etc. as "F.O.B.s". I see where you're coming from though.
I think it depends on who you talk to. As an ABC, I don't find it offensive at all. I personally use it as a descriptor, not in any derogatory sense. My friends who immigrated here when they were older teens or young adults wear the term "fob" proudly. And my friends who immigrated here when they were young children are still offended by it, most likely because of lingering bad memories. I don't say it around them.
I disagree, fob, in its deepest meaning holds no allegiance to a certain "race" or "culture"; everyone who is an immigrant is "fresh off the boat".
I also think the, for the lack of a better word, 'etymology' of "fob" has never reflected the word to have the same social impact as the "n-word" or the "c-word". I think I can safely say that I'm not in the minority when it comes to being apathetic to being called a "fob", even at a ridiculously superficial level.
I believe the word "Fob" resembles that of African-American's "N-word". Only Asians, particularly Southeast Asians "Boat People", are allowed to use it , otherwise, it's a racist/derogatory term. Like the N-word, I wouldn't doubt it that a white person came up with the term.
My (non-Asian) friends use the term "boater" when referring to other "fobs".
I find "fobby" traits endearing because it's like a relic from my childhood, like care bears and smurfs. I mean, do Fobs still exist? Asians (in Asia) are just as savy, modern, and fashionable (if not more so) then the Asians here. I think the era of immigrants covering their nice table cloth with a clear vinyl ones and re-using disposable wooden chopsticks, is gone- Which is why I find it endearing, it reminds me of my grandmother.
Besides, it seems like a lot of Asians I know are trying to copy Asians in Asia so being called a fob, at times, is a compliment.
My post about "chinglish" had an "endearing" usage of "fob", but it was lost in the negative connotations the word still holds as shown by mitsuru's comment. I defend it's usage, I don't know to what effect though.
http://www.8asians.com/2009/06/24/engrishchingl...
I think my case is similar to that of the Gene Yang and the Wu's, in that I grew up in a predominately Asian/Asian American town that had a lot of Asian immigrants. The term fob held negative connotations in that recent immigrants were socially different, but they were not social outcasts. They had their own social circles and friends... and the groups, for some very obvious and not so obvious reasons, never seemed to blend. But it did put in context how Gene Yang describes the usage of the word. It became such common vernacular that it evolved to a term of endearment... to the point that by the time I entered highschool, our usage of "fob" was no longer deemed by the community as derogatory.
I think this is because, as years passed, the people we had dubbed "fobs" in elementary school, slowly became "less fobby" and social bubbles merged, but the term "fobs" stuck to these individuals. Therefore, those who were seen as socially outcast or different had become friends and peers, but their titles and nicknames stuck. As such, the term "fob" morphed from something derogatory to something endearing.
Also relevant: the debate that Joz and I had about a year ago to the day about mymomisafob:
http://www.8asians.com/2008/12/04/is-my-mom-is-...
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