8Asians.com » Say My Name: Changing my Adoptive Name

Say My Name: Changing my Adoptive Name

By Guest Writer | Friday, March 27, 2009 | Comments

By Chunsoon

Sitting down in a chair the other day, a funny thing happened: I turned a year older. It got me thinking about my name. Six months earlier I’d handed over some papers and a check for two-hundred dollars; just like that I became Chun-Soon Li. So, like a blanket of snow that falls on our city, or a cool spoon pressed on the eyes, I applied a new name, though a very old name, to myself.

If I was given a name at birth, it is gone with the woman who could say it. There was a day. It was raining, that’s how I’ll tell it. On this day I wandered off from my mother, or was placed in a basket like a little yellow Moses, or left behind in one of the ways it happens, just like that. I was about a year old and didn’t know anything. She was a young woman, as I’ve always seen her, beautiful despite the day. Did she hold me one last time? Did she pray for us?

Adoption is many things. It’s commonplace, it’s a dream-come-true (for some), and it’s an efficient way to deal with a surplus of orphans. During the Korean war, transnational adoption solved the embarrassing problem of biracial offspring sired by Western soldiers. These children, thousands of them, were the scar tissue of the wounds of war, representing the double blight of mixed-race and illegitimacy (their unmarried mothers bearing the brunt of this stigma). In 1956, a zealous American named Harry Holt formed the Holt International Adoption Agency in an effort to harvest the “seed from the East” as prophesied in Isaiah 45:3. By the 1960’s, war babies were replaced by a new supply of orphans, by-products of South Korea’s brutal push to industrialise.

But I want to speak to the heart of the matter: The status of women is the status of children in society — don’t let the guys in charge tell you otherwise. In Korea, divorced women, raped women, and unwed mothers all face the same stigma of being… deeply… sullied. There is no social support system which helps them survive in Korean society, much less provide for their children. To date, there have been over 150,000 Korean children sent out-of-country as adoptees, two-thirds of them to the US. This industry nets Korea between fifteen to twenty million dollars per anum, which is to say that selling off your unwanted children is more lucrative than caring for them, or implementing the systemic changes that would keep families together in the first place.

In the past fifteen years we’ve seen seventeen nations call an end to transnational adoption due to charges of exploitation, coercion of birth mothers, abduction and child trafficking. This contrasts sharply against the shining picture of an integrated American family with Asian kids, which is the image in the Holt catalogs. When children are sent out-of-country, they are sent West. They are sent to white families who Mean Well. And they are given new names.

People have always had their own names for me: Mary, Mao, Pumpkin, Slowpoke. Identity, for an adoptee, is the feeling that nothing is yours by birthright. At times there is a freedom to this, an untethered-ness that is nice; mostly, though, it just feels weird. My adoptive parents saved my life, and they did it with Christian love in their hearts. They even retained my “temporary Korean name”, Chun-Soon, as my middle name. Six months ago, I reclaimed it. This one piece of my mother’s land that I do have. I chose the family name Li (Yi, Rhee, Lee)…an ordinary, commonplace name. A typical Korean name. Confucius be damned, I am now the beginning of my bloodline in this country.

So say my name, family and friends.

Say my name, chagiya, as no one else can.

Because nothing ever just happens, just like that, please say my name.

CSLi is a classically trained artist living in Brooklyn, NY, who dreams of the day when killer concubines and the meek inherit the earth. All issues which have, at heart, the struggle of the powerless to free themselves are important to her.

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Ernie

Great post! How did your adoptive parents react to you changing your name? Supportive, I assume?

CSLi

Ah. You know, we've never directly talked about it. They're good people, and within their structure of understanding things (conservative white middle-class hetero christians), they meant well. But what can I say? It wasn't always enough. My adoptive family stills calls me by my "American" name, and I allow it because I don't want to hurt them.

jennifer

my korean name is my legal name, but no one calls me by my korean name except for my parents/relatives/people in Korea, so I'm considering changing my name legally to Jennifer for convenience purposes.

thanks for sharing your unique perspective.

Tim

@CSLi - I loved your post. Thank you for sharing it with us.

@Jennifer: My legal name when we moved to the U.S. was my Chinese name, but my parents enrolled me in school as Timothy, I applied for a drivers license at 17 with Timothy as my name. I never legally changed my name to Timothy, but it turns out if you use an alias for more than 10 years, it's legally your name. Even my passport says Timothy now (it never used to). The only thing that still bears only my Chinese name is my naturalization papers.

Moye

I really admire your decision to return to your original name. I've read that a lot of Korean adoptees struggle to learn about their native culture or claim it as their own, but I really love how you've done so through your name.

And I hope it won't be a problem for your adoptive family to call you by your old name. It's how they identify with you, old habits are hard to change and you will always maintain that rapport with them.

john

thanks for sharing. I just don't think it's right to imply that somehow a group of people, or an entire country, are supporting international adoption becaus there is money to be made. Have you ever run across an adoption tycoon? Sure, there are criminals who exploit adoption to make a buck, but that has nothing to do with adoption and everything to do with bad people finding ways to do bad things.

Kim

Chun-Soon Li ~

Sorry to be so blunt, but there is a rather politically correct movement which would end international adoption if it could, and it uses nearly all the touch phrases which you do in your personal account. But this movement never seems to get around to some of the harder, more fundamental questions. If you could, perhaps you can select from the list below those which you might feel comfortable answering?

Are you happy you were adopted? Would you have rather been adopted into a Korean family---and was that a realistic possibility at the time you were orphaned? Would you have rather been raised in the Korean orphanage---and raised Korean, in Korea---I don't know the Korean system---do orphans raised in the orphanages have generally the same opportunities as children raised in intact families? Do you love your family---and they you-- unconditionally?

Thinking about the woman who birthed you---but have never met---is she entirely blameless in your eyes for abandoning you at age one? For instance, do you truly believe that the social (and apparently,market) forces to which you subscribe are solely to blame for your predicament---and not the personal decision of a Korean woman, and perhaps, a man, and perhaps of the extended Korean family---to spare your life---but to also separate you from them?

BlueEyedBuddhist

My wife went the other route. Adopted from Korea by a white Mormon family at the age of 11, she had kept using her Korean name into adulthood... and eventually gave it up.

Now she just goes by her Americanized version of her name because she's found it more convenient. When we got married recently, she changed her family name to mine as well. (I'm just old-school enough that I pushed her to do this, though I could have lived with it if she hadn't!)

For many years as an adult, she kept her Korean name as her middle name, but trying to fit it into passports, computer systems with her employer, and so forth was too big a pain in the neck for her.

To her Korean (birth) mother (now living in Okubo district in Tokyo), she'll always go by her Korean name, of course- but to the rest of the world, she uses her Americanized name, and she's okay with that, too.

Many of the things you talk about in this entry are things that affected her- her birth parents' divorce, her father's remarriage to a younger woman who treated the stepchildren like dirt, her mother's inability to care for her (being an unwed divorcee), the money issues behind her adoption...

But for her, it ultimately boils down to a more simple issue: It's just easier to use an Anglicized type of name. It's not good, bad, or indifferent; it just is.

I understand your statement and reasons behind changing your name, but the reality can be considerably different for others, of course. For my wife, being adopted was the best thing in her life. She says so, frequently, and even her birth mom said so when I met her recently.

This complicates things. I commend you on using the name you choose, but please don't let your motivations guide you to look down upon people who go the opposite route. (Not that you indicated that- I'm just sayin', is all.)

CSLi

There are so many thoughtful and intelligent comments, thank you. I'll try my best to respond/reply here, though some of these issues aren't best explored in a short format. There are >hundreds of adoption-adoptee-adoptive parent blogs and websites out there that address these things better than I can here, but I'll do my best.

First, Moye: I agree. Why hurt people who only tried to help and love me? If they understand my reasons for the name change beyond a superficial "oh I get it, she's upset about being adopted and wants to have a Korean name" sort of understanding, then they'll call me by my chosen name (as one sister, also an adoptee, does). If they don't understand, or they want to keep using my adopted name because it's more comfortable/less painful/less weird, I am okay with that too. Some people have said that everyone should use my chosen name out of respect for my decision, but respect does go both ways. And besides, the only form of respect that matters, at the end of the day, is self-respect. And I know what my name is.

One thing I want to say, which enters my mind as I'm writing, is that I'm tremendously GRATEFUL to my adoptive parents for enduring the financial burden, bureaucracy, emotional toll, and any stigma that might have come with adopting me (in effect, saving my life). In fact, they adopted four of us from Korea, raised six kids on one income, and we never wanted for necessities. What a feat! Many transracial/transnational adoptees will say that they are not grateful, or that gratitude has no part in the adoption conversation. I understand this response, but don't share it. I think it's okay to acknowledge the sacrifice others make for us, it's okay to look at the facts of their love and good intentions, and to see all the opportunities their sacrifice afforded us. It's also okay, on the other hand, to see the negative conditions which ARE a part of the adoption conversation, and to be honest about them.

CSLi

This brings me to John and Kim: I'm not lumping you into one person, as you've both brought up very good points. Let me try to address them.

John: Have I ever met an adoption tycoon? No. Do I know that adoption agencies like Holt International are NOT LACKING in funds? Yes. There's no shortage of funds because there's no shortage of orphans. Why are there so many abandoned children? Where do they come from? I did not imply that Korea (and other nations who export babies to the "first" world) make money doing so -- I said it. But you do have a point, the government is often at odds with its people, and in Korea, the people are starting to think hard about this business of transnational adoption. That distinction can be made. However, one is still hears reports (if one is listening) about birth mothers coerced into giving up their babies, children being classified as "orphans" while their family's whereabouts are known, and, of course, about the patrilineal/patriarchal social structure that vilifies single motherhood and, in many cases, female children. These things happen, and they are not exceptional: societies have their illnesses, and Korea's adoption industry is where its symptoms can be found. (Of course, societies that are on the buying end of the transaction also evidence their illness: dark-skinned babies are passed over for white and asian ones). You seem to feel that the great number of adoption "success" stories is a greater good in the face of these symptoms. I say, let's identify the root of the problem. Am I calling adoptive parents or adoptees a problem? Goodness no. But like I stated before, there needs to be some honesty. Let's call a problem what it is.

Kim, sometimes "politically correct" is, simply, correct.
But I don't mean to dismiss you. To your list of thoughtful and difficult questions:

1. Am I happy I was adopted? I'm not sure how to answer this. Like most people (I suspect), I am happy to be alive in general and am grateful to my adoptive parents for enabling that. But do I wish that I had a relationship with my biological family? Hell yes. Am I unhappy about the fact that they were unwilling or unable to raise me? Ditto. Do I know enough about the adoption industry to have misgivings about it? Yes.

2. Would I rather have been adopted by Koreans? Sure, that would have been better in some ways. I'd have retained the Korean language plus learned English, I'd have seen faces quite like mine at an age when one formulates "identity", and for probably a myriad of tiny, daily reasons I would have been better "adjusted". But if you mean a Korean couple in Korea (which didn't happen much in the 70's), I would not have "adjusted" so well to such a male-dominated culture -- though in my fantasy world, since we're talking about fantasy now, this couple would be totally cool and allow me to be who I am.

3. Orphans enjoy a rather diminished status wherever they exist, but in Korea the opportunities for me would have been especially rare. This is one of the things for which I'm grateful -- did I say that enough? -- but grateful is not blind.

The last questions are the toughest, obviously. Abandonment (and the awareness of it) is a trauma, and some orphans may process the stages of loss over a lifetime. If you view the issues of transnational/transracial adoption as a "politically correct" trend comprising the "touch phrases" of people who avoid fundamental questions (ie. about their abandonment), then you are not in a position to hear what they are saying. It's ALL about the abandonment, Kim. But rather than wallow endlessly in guilt, inadequacy, and blaming Mother (which we do, you'll see), it is reasonable, productive and simply honest to pull back and look at the big picture. And the big picture is ugly.

Do I think my biological mother/parents had any agency in the decision to give me up? Well, let's assume that it was a decision and not one of those instances of child trafficking that makes the news now and again. In short, do I BLAME her or them for giving me up? Well, yes and no. When I was younger I did. You can imagine the anger and sadness. But as we get older and learn more, our eyes and minds widen a bit, and I was able to see some facts that helped me understand WHY she might have done that. This helps quell the anger, but the sadness and loss still exist. To answer your question, Kim, I think every adoptee feels the sting of this loss, but may not be in a position to discuss it. Perhaps that's why you feel the "movement" has not addressed this pain. In my opinion, this pain is the greatest fuel...if something in society is hurting a group of people, do you really want them to sit around and blame their mothers? Are there not conditions in society that factor in? Shouldn't we try to locate and excise the problems?

Let's say, for the sake of argument, that my mother was a prostitute who kept having babies in order to sell them to adoption agencies. Would this change my feelings about the adoption industry, or about the status of women in Korea? Would it not underscore it?

Kim

Well, Chun Soon Li,

I guess we will have to disagree on some issues.

As I stated at the outset---I don't have experience with the system in Korea, but I do know, that Harry Holt, (a fellow Oregonian, now deceased) ---the man which I think you think, had something to do with an alleged orphan baby trade was a good and honorable man, and was honored and respected in South Korea, even up to his death.

You state: "Sometimes politically correct is simply correct" You also state: "If you view the issues of transnational/transracial adoption as a “politically correct” trend comprising the “touch phrases” of people who avoid fundamental questions (ie. about their abandonment), then you are not in a position to hear what they are saying".

Actually, I am. Perhaps better than you.

Daughter #1 had no memory of abandonment, since it occurred on a street in Taizhou China, when she was a new born infant. Her orphanage, as was typical at the time, was rather hard scrabble. She came to us with a number of ailments, including pneumonia, but they were nothing we couldn't fix.

#2, unfortunately, had some memory of her abandonment. And as an older child, was placed in a situation with other older children, in sort of a "Lord of the flies" environment. Some of what she did to adjust was sort of cute, some of it was very anti-social, and we paid a substantial (emotional) price to pull her into the family, which intimately was very rewarding and successful.

But again, these are issues that are personal (and I'm, quite amazed that you don't give more credit to your family----the only family you have ever known----for shaping the person you are now.)

But no matter. You miss the larger point----you were abandoned by the woman (and family) who birthed you. You have warm feelings for that woman, but you have never met her, and probably never will---so its all a fantasy.

Here is what is so sad about you, and yes---the "politically correct" movement that you subscribe to: In China at least, International adoption is one force that in the last 20 years has placed value on Chinese girls. It is one dynamic that has saved their lives.

See, Chun-Soon Li, in China, to this day, there is infanticide, of girls, mostly, but not to the extent that there once was---and as I have written here before, its good that the ratio of boys to girls places more value on girls in China than in the past. And thats why I first asked you: What was it like in Korea at the time you were an orphan. And also: at least the family which abandoned you----spared your life.

Maybe you need to take a harder, and closer look at your personal background, and be more grateful to the gifts which you have been given by your American family, and less of this, politically correct, "think past the truth" ----horse shit

Shelise

Kim -

Show some respect to Li Chun Soon. She is sharing her personal views and experience, based on her experience as an adoptee. Please don't go the route of discrediting her personal experience because you don't agree with her political views of adoption.

Your responses to Li Chun Soon's comments demonstrate that you in fact "are not in a position to hear what they are saying" or to examine where your own insecurities about gratitude from adopteess may be coming from.

Being an adoptive parent does not make you an expert on adoptee the experience. You are only one piece of the adoption triad, not the final authority on the personal experience of an adoptee. You will never know what it feels like to be an adoptee. Period. You may know what it is like to raise adopted children, but you cannot claim their experience as your own, especially as a tool to attack others.

Finally, the list of questions you posed to Li Chun Soon is unfair. No one can change the past or see what might have been. All we can do is use our actually experience to develop our own opinions and look toward the future.

P.S. I think its fair to say that opinions about Harry Holt vary greatly.

kristin

i think this post is fascinating for so many reasons but especially because of the comments by "Kim." as an adult korean adoptee who just started the journey of self-discovery regarding my adoption, i am amazed that folks who do not share the adoption experience have such strong feelings about my family, both birth and adoptive and how i should feel about them. kim-i understand how you might perceive the experience as an outsider, but please take care with your biting words as you can never truly appreciate our experience and should not reduce our search for our history as ungrateful or unloving toward our families whom we love dearly.

Sang-Shil

Kim --

First of all... "horse shit"? Really? Is that really an effective and adult contribution to any conversation, let alone in response to a thoughtful essay from someone willing to share her personal views on a very personal topic? It's fine to disagree, as you stated. It is NOT fine to personally attack someone else and berate her for not confirming your own personal choice to adopt.

Chunsoon graciously attempted to answer your insulting and utterly condescending list of questions in an honest, straightforward, and rational manner. And yet you respond by telling her what and how to think and cap it all off with an expletive? I am sorely disappointed that you thought that to be an appropriate response. Even adoptees who are more aligned with your sentiments than Chunsoon's would not appreciate being treated in such a manner.

As an aside, it's funny (as in, not very) how adoptees are always the ones that are dismissed as "angry," because I read a lot more anger in your words than in those of any self-identified adoptee here.

John aka Jae-Yong

Dear Chun-Soon Li,

Thank you for sharing your personal experience on this matter. My birth name is Byun, Jae Yong. In 2004, I met my birth father and his wife. I also learned that I have a half brother. My first experience with my birth name was when my birth father would call out to me. 50% of the time I wouldn't even realize he was calling me, but to be honest the other 50% of the time, I would hear him but just wouldn't answer. Why did I do this, I guess my feelings were still a bit raw regarding my adoption and that was my little subtle way of getting back at him? I don't know, it was certainly childish on my part and I certainly don't do that now. I stay in touch with him and I will actually be visiting my birth family this summer. When I am there, I do go by my birth name. It's a bit of a validation when my birth name is used. It shows me that my life did not start at Chapter Two. That Chapter One did take place and it took place in Korea.

Sincerely,
John aka Byun, Jae-Yong

Dear Kim,

I hope you acknowledge that you have as much invested in the adoption of your children, as they do. Adoptees are not pawns in the story of some "good doers". Family’s need each other that is what defines a family. Also, adoptees do not come as blank slates. In fact, according to psychologist, the most crucial time for any child’s development is during the 9 months they are in the womb up to a year old. I wish you well on your journey on raising a trans-racial family.

Sincerely,
John aka Byun, Jae-Yong

Tonggu Momma

I believe that personal insecurities need to fall by the wayside when one becomes an adoptive parent, especially one who adopts transracially. It is ALL about the best interests of the child, even when that child becomes a teen and later an adult. If returning to your original name helps you as you continue to live out your life story, then who am I (or others) to judge that? The name change doesn't alter your relationship with your adoptive parents, although their response to said name change might. It's just a name, but sometimes a name is everything.

from an adoptive momma, whose five-year-old daughter recently asked to be called by her Chinese name at all times, although that only lasted about ten minutes before she decided she instead wished to forevermore be known as "Belle Ariel Cinderella Princess"

Mara

Oh my Kim. As a fellow adoptive parent I am always amazed by how completely clueless we can be. It is not the adoptive parents place to pass any judgement at all on an adoptive person's experience. Don't you understand that the adoptive parent has always had all the power in the triad? And your posting of such insensitive (and may I say unsophisticated) criticism is completely uncalled for. And telling her to be 'grateful'? Seriously. Like adoptees have never heard that before. And using 'politically correct' as something negative just lets us know that you are unwilling to do the work to be respectful and correct as evidenced in you comments above. Your children (the ones I am sure you love completely) have a history, culture and a story before you and if you keep feeding them the 'gratefulness' Kool-Aid, your relationship will suffer and your children will learn quickly that you do not honour their whole selves and what a huge loss that will be for you, and how painful for them.

Chun Soon took the time to answer your questions (even though they were rude, invasive and insensitive) with amazing graciousness and instead of just disagreeing,you had the audacity to call her choices/viewpoints 'horse shit'. As adoptive parents it is not our job (or our right) to dictate our children's feelings, it's to validate them, even if it hurts us, or even if we disagree. That is what it means to be a parent. We're here to support them, not looking to feed our own egos. The truth is that the basis of adoption is loss and it's our job as adoptive parent to navigate that for our children or we have no business adopting.
Chun Soon, thank you for sharing your very personal story. I appreciate it very much. I also want you to know that not all AP's are like Kim, some of us really are trying to be allies even when it means calling our own choices into question.

Mara

atlasien

@Kim: your visceral hatred for Asian cultures is horrifying. On this thread you are spouting either white supremacy or Asian self-hatred (and my goodness, I hope you aren't Asian).

Why did you adopt children from a culture you hate so much? As an Asian-American and adoptive parent I find your attitude to be disgraceful and repulsive. Take a deep look into your soul and try to find some decency.

Confuse_Us

Maybe you need to take a harder, and closer look at your personal background, and be more grateful to the gifts which you have been given by your American family, and less of this, politically correct, “think past the truth” —-horse shit.

That sounds like a recipe for bad adoptive parenting. I'm lucky to have had parents that never threw the "you should be more grateful" manipulation at me. For that I'm truly grateful.

Lori

Hello Li Chun Soon and congratulations on your name change. Thank you for your point of view here and I am deeply impressed by your gracious and thoughtful answers to everyone here.

-Kim - a few words to you from another adoptive parent (I am guessing that you are white, as I am, though you don't specify) - my daughter from China is in preK and doesn't know anything about political correctness. But I have heard many of these feelings from her already. No one suggested them to her. She cannot read yet. I hope you can at least find it in yourself to listen to your own children. I hope you do not silence them with contempt, as you are trying to do here to someone about whose life you know so little.

Kim

@ Chun-Soon Li, Shelise, Kristin, Sang-Shil:

Wow, a full court press. Sorry, I’m unrepentant.

Note that I haven’t attacked anyone. I think its fine that Chun-Soon Li has selected a new name, and as an adoptive father, if my daughters were to do the same, I’d be fine with that too, not at all threatened by it. Also, its great if Chun-Soon Li wants to explore Korea, to find some cultural anchor apparently missing in her life. 8Asians has many accounts here about Asian Americans doing just that, I read about their experiences, trials and tribulations (Mandarin particularly), and applaud their efforts, just as I cheer on my own daughters in the same pursuit.

But lets just be clear about who Chun-Soon Li is currently, and expose the facts about this horse shit politically correct movement, the goal of which is ending international adoption

By every indication, Chun-Soon Li is American. except for adoption at birth. She has only one family, also American, and by blood only, she has a link to a Korean woman who birthed her, but whom she has never met. And the gifts she brought from Korea to America are limited to her genetic make up, and her life. The articulate nature of her posts, and (those in her support), lead me to believe all of you has benefited from a stable upbringing, significant educational opportunities, and complete freedom from material want, as is the American tradition.

I’m familiar with argument techniques which attempt to win points by marginalizing me, rather than refuting facts. Mostly, I won’t respond, but a couple are just so absurd:

Shelsie: “Being an adoptive parent does not make you an expert on adoptee the experience” It doesn’t? So what does, research and a master’s thesis? Shelsie, I’m there for my daughters every day. You have the nerve to inject yourself into my nuclear family to speculate what I might, or might not know about my daughter’s frame of mind? You have no clue what challenges my daughters brought home from the orphanage, much less how they were resolved---you will never be included in our family decisions---how dare you?

Such an apt illustration of the soullessness of this horse shit movement. The attack is on me and other parents who have had the nerve to adopt internationally. Its implicit, here, though powerfully stated. Unfortunately, there was a time when it was explicit and directed towards good friends of mine. The decision to adopt is by its very nature, extremely personal and soul searching. Theirs is a typical profile, after many years of trying, they exhausted other means to have children naturally, and had recently arrived back in the US with a delightful Chinese daughter, proud and happy parents. A group of us were celebrating, and were somehow introduced to some academics from out of town. After several minutes of small talk, the conversation turned to this very subject, at which time one of the academics proceeded to berate the family with the new arrival; that this baby should have never left China, it was all wrong to take babies from their “culture”. and that it amounted to an act of “cultural imperialism” by the parents (the new mother, now in uncontrollable tears). I noticed a certain satisfaction in this academic woman, a certain smug, “mission accomplished” look about her when she was done.

I’m assuming all of you know better than to try to inject yourself into the private family matters of all-Asian families---that being largely Confucian and conservative---they would hand you your head. Unfortunately, parents adopting internationality tend to liberal, and vulnerable.

I guess it takes academia to elevate every grievance and perceived slight to an equal level with all others, and I really wouldn’t care if the Korean/American adoptee's plaint were simply: “its all about me” in fact, I’d have some sympathy---but that's not the case. This movement seeks to inject itself into the very personal and private family decisions of families like mine: “Its all about me, so I want YOU to change”

But there are, as Jackson Brown sings, those: who’s “lives hang in the balance” and their fate is callously, even studiously ignored by this horse shit movement. “Kim, sometimes “politically correct” is, simply, correct.” And Chun-Soon Li, how many times did we hear that last century, and its equivalent---just before the ax fell snuffing out thousands of lives?

Several weeks ago, I got a call from an old friend who had just seen SlumdogMillionare: “you know, I now think I really understand what you’ve been trying to tell me about orphans all these years” ---good Kev, except it was staged in India---by Bollywood. Still, the flick does seem to project a certain fundamental truth, as good fiction often does.

So with China in mind, first an account about those who didn’t even get the basic gift all of you adoptees received. Its also noteworthy for those who believe China’s one-child policy is the cause of the massive disparity of boys to girls that these events happened well before PR China:

“Infanticide in a starving city like this is dreadfully common. For the parents, seeing their children must be doomed to poverty, think it better at once to let the soul escape in search of a more happy asylum than to linger in one condemned to want and wretchedness. The infanticide is, however, exclusively confined to the destruction of female children, the sons being permitted to live in order to continue the ancestral sacrifices.

One mother I met, who was employed by this mission, told the missionary in ordinary conversation that she had suffocated in turn three of her female children within a few days of birth: and, when f fourth was born, so enraged was her husband to discover that it was a girl also that he seized it by the legs and struck it against the wall and killed it.

Dead children, and often living infants, are thrown out on the common among the grave mounds, and be seen there any morning being gnawed by dogs. Mr. Tremberth of the Bible Christian Mission, leaving by the south gate early one morning, disturbed a dog eating a still living child that had been thrown over the wall in the night. Its little arm was crunched and stripped of flesh, and it was whining inarticulately - it died almost immediately.”

Fast-forward now to the current plight of China’s unwanted girls---how bad is it? Its not easy to know, and I’m not going to quote alot more, but to get a perspective, I suggest those interested Google: “The mystery of China’s lost girls” (Asia Times)

Kristin

Kim-

The plight of women in Chinese is deplorable, however, consider for one minute that the solution may not necessarily be to remove women from its society entirely but rather to change the government which promotes the behaviors.

Further, while I applaud your commitment to your young daughters, please understand that we adult adoptees have lived the life you have yet to experience second hand through your daughters. Is it not possible that perhaps we can offer more credible opinions based upon our actual experiences than you who do not have the benefit of personal reflection? Do I not have the right to own my own feelings?

Please get a copy of The Primal Wound by Nancy Newton Verrier.

"According to 1985 statistics used by Parenting Resources of Santa Ana, California, although adoptees at that time comprised 2-3% of the population of this country, they represented 30-40% of the individuals found in residential treatment centers, juvenile hall, and special schools. They demonstrated a high incidence of juvenile delinquency, sexual promiscuity, and running away from home. They have had more difficulty in school, both academically and socially, than their non-adopted peers. The adoptees referred for treatment had relatively consistent symptoms, which are characterized as impulsive, provocative, aggressive, and antisocial."

While these issues are not insurmountable, they exist and should be addressed. We love our adoptive families but ignoring us is not the answer. Like daughter #1, I too have no specific memory of abandonment as I was an infant when the event occurred. It is only now that I have connected with fellow adoptees that I have gained the shared words to express feelings of emptiness and loss that I felt growing up white. Prior to meeting other KADs, I had no idea why I felt this way. Or that my adoption or my Korean-ness played major roles in my life at all. I feel foolish for my naivite.

Your use of "apparently" is particularly demeaning in your statement "its great if Chun-Soon Li wants to explore Korea, to find some cultural anchor apparently missing in her life." Who is marginalizing who? These are our lives-we did not have any say in the matter! In the very least, give us the right to express ourselves since for so long, we have not had the words or the forum to share our experiences. All we ask is that you listen to us. We are simply asking for our histories.

Jae Ran

Chun-Soon,
As another Korean adoptee who legally changed their name, congratulations and may this be the beginning of a wonderful time in your life.

While there are always those (and they are not always adoptive parents - sometimes even strangers and friends) who will criticize you for this decision, just know that there are many supporters an allies - including adoptive parents - who understand and are happy for you.

My adoptive parents had a hard time for the first year, but they have now embraced my Korean name too, even though out of respect for them I did not demand that they call me by my Korean name.

All I can say about Kim's comments is that it makes me sad for his daughters that he holds such rigid and disrespectful views. But those of us adult Asian adoptees, and our allies like those here who have commented, we'll be there for those girls in 20 years and welcome them with open arms.

Mara

Oh Kim, in your unrepentance you have again tried to marginalize, belittle and assert your authority into the adoptee experience. You say you have not attacked yet you feel entitled enough to tell someone that they should be 'grateful', you feel empowered enough to call someone's viewpoint 'horse shit'. You do not get to tell Chun Soon that she only has one family. Do you realize that when you marginalize someone's birthfamily you in turn are marginalizing the adoptee? In your own words, how dare you?

And regardless of your great feelings of experience, you are not your children and you will not be able to control their feelings about their origins. You do not get to proclaim expertise about their experience. This is the epitome of adoptive parent huberus, speaking solely through your privilege and world view without it widening a crack to even consider an opposing view. You even have the arrogance to state "But lets just be clear about who Chun-Soon Li is currently.." Sorry you don't get to define her, even if you think that you do know everything.

I don't think anyone here denies the very harsh realities of the world and how IA is incredibly complex on a variety of levels. And as we look through our lens of privilege we had better be willing to ask ourselves tough questions. It does appear that you see yourself as saviour to the destitute children of the inferior world around you, but you deny the complexities that are inherent in IA. Even though IA may be the last best chance a child has at a family, there are simultaneously colonialist elements. The issues of privilege and race play extensive roles. Why is it that we are always on the winning side of the equation? It is certainly not because we are more worthy. It also appears that you see yourself as far superior to the Asian culture you deride, and once again that makes me sorry for your girls.

If I've learned anything as an adoptive parent it is that love is not enough, it just isn't. And hopefully when your girls need more you will have grown enough to have moved past your derision of their birth culture and opened your heart to allow them their feelings about being adopted. And maybe you can do it without telling them to be grateful and trying to erase their life before you.
Mara

Shelise

Kim,

You ask: '“Being an adoptive parent does not make you an expert on adoptee the experience” It doesn’t? So what does, research and a master’s thesis?'

I say, again, NO, being an adoptive parent does not make you an expert on the *adoptee experience*. It makes you an expert on the adoptive parent experience. Being an adoptee, as I am, makes me an expert on my adoptee experience, as Chunsoon is an expert on her experience, as your daughters will be on their experience. Your children may be able to share their experience or feelings with you, but you can never speak from a point of view where you can claim to know exactly their experience, unless you yourself are an adoptee. I can guess what it's like to be a biological child, but I'll never really know that experience because I was adopted.

As far as the political agenda you posit some adoptees are trying to inject into your personal life, I would say what many APs say. Our intentions are good. We adoptees are putting our own experiences out there so that the adoptees behind us might have a chance to live their adoptee experience differently and ease some of the pain we encountered, especially as asian faces with white parents who try to downplay our difference i.e. you're just an american like everybody else. I dare because I care, Kim.

Finally, it is plain to see that we will never agree on status of international adoption or who can say what about adoptees and so I will argue with you no further and only wish the best to you and your family.

P.S. Kim, if you live in OR, you should check out the organization Adoption Mosaic, www.adoptionmosaic.org. They are a great resource for all members of the adoption constellation.

atlasien

Some points in Kim's loopy racist rant:

-- Asians are inarticulate. Only those who have been sufficiently assimilated can speak English, much less have articulate opinions.

-- Adoptees are not allowed to speak about their own experiences. Unlike regular children, they never grow up, and their parents are in charge of interpreting their life forever.

-- Being an adoptive parent means you're white... and Chinese children are never adopted by Chinese or Chinese-Americans. Oh yes, and these adoptive parents are always blameless martyrs whose choices are always above criticism.

-- All Asian families are "conservative and Confucian". This is a neat little generalization showing that Kim is not Asian (whew!) and learned all he knows about Asian cultures from a combination of fortune cookie messages and an adoption agency brochure.

-- paragaph 10: combine irrelevant Jackson Browne lyric, insinuation of creeping communism, ludicrous mixed metaphor about axes snuffing out candles (?!?), place in blender, press "liquefy intelligent thought" (I suppose this wasn't a point at all)

-- Some stories about female infanticide from a century ago proving that the HEATHEN CHINEE are an evil race and should not be trusted to raise their own children. Nevermind that around that same time period in the American West, Chinese immigrants were being randomly lynched and murdered by angry white mobs in organized ethnic cleansing programs.

It must severely disturb similar racist troglodytes to hear that China has been increasing domestic adoption to the point where they'll probably shut down international soon. But I guess they'll always have their racist stereotypes to comfort themselves with.

Kim

@ Kristin ---

Actually, my experience is that the condition of women in China can be quite powerful. Certainly, the women in my family weld quite a bit of power in the family, and in their professions.

I want you, as an adoptee to know, that of course, I can't appreciate the feelings of loss that adoptees go through---that is very personal. And I hold my breath, as every adopted parent does, for the time that my daughters confront their loss, and how I might assist in that latest hurdle..

My point here is this though: I know this political movement quite well---the one that wants to end international adoption. And perhaps I'm wrong, and a little cynical, but I view Chun-Soon Li's original post---and follow up comments as something of an attempt to wrap her personal sense of loss around the political movement to end international adoption.

In cases where people behave this way, I'm inclined to bypass the heartstrings---and go straight to the politics which are at the core of the message. Chun-Soon Li can certainly separate herself of that movement, if she wants to.

Neff

Despite my personal views, I'm glad to see this thoughtful and impassioned discussion. It demonstrates the need for further discussion like this. There is a lot of misunderstanding about international adoption which can only be expected considering it's only 50 something years old. Considering that, we are now at a point where long term impacts can be seen, particularly by looking at South Korea. How has international adoption affected Korea and Koreans? How can the system be improved?

Mei-Ling

"Fast-forward now to the current plight of China’s unwanted girls—how bad is it?"

All I'm going to say (for now?) is that there is a difference between "unwanted" and "not permitted to keep." Likewise, there is a difference between "abandoned and unwanted" and "abandoned BUT LOVED."

Those two issues are not necessarily mutual.

윤선

Kim: Wow... is all I can say to you... just... wow... I don't think I'm even going to bother saying anything to you...

ChunSoon: As another Korean adoptee, I think you're very brave to officially change your name back to your Korean name. I've often considered doing so (hence the use of my Korean name here and other places online), but I don't think I could do it officially... I'm not too sure why... But it has crossed my mind many times, considering it was the first name I was given. This was a good, brave, honest post. I think we adoptees often need to be heard more...

Mama Nabi

I am neither an adoptee nor an adoptive parent. I am a mother and I have volunteered during school holidays at "orphanages" in Korea.

I realize that, as I write and delete comment and comment in response to the above vitriolic and patronizing comments by an adoptive father, nothing anyone says would do much difference - he does not see this as an opportunity to become part of what is potentially his own adopted daughters' futures; he is merely using this platform for his own anti-liberal political agenda, seizing this chance to belittle an adult adoptee's personal story for his own rants against what he refers to as "horse shit politics".

I hope that he will set his politics aside when dealing with his own adopted daughters, should they need his support while exploring their own identities.

That said... as a friend of many adoptees who have made the decision to either legally or unofficially change their given names back to their Korean names, I am somewhat familiar with the myriad of emotions involved with that process. Chunsoon, I just wanted to say thank you for sharing your story and I love that you are reclaiming your Korean name.

Paula O.

Chunsoon, this is such a powerful and beautifully written piece - thank you for sharing it both here and on your blog.

As a fellow Korean adoptee as well as an AP of a son born in Korea, I am so happy to see yet another adoptee speaking her truth.

Margie

Congratulations to you, Chunsoon, for taking this step toward an identity that belongs to YOU. I apologize that you have had to bear Kim's diatribe.

@Kim: When you talk to adopted individuals as you have spoken to Chun-Soon here, Kim, what I see is you talking to my kids. And that makes me mad, very mad. Zip it.

Kim

@Margie --- once again, yet another who presumes to know what goes on in my household, and to know about my relationship with my daughters, and what is best for them---never having met them----------so many of you here...

....its exactly that mind set the scares the Hell out of me. I extrapolate from that all of you must think you also know what is best for all the warehoused girls in all the orphanages in China----and around to globe. Amazing that none of you have actually been able to get past my perceived slight to Chun-soon Li, to discuss the bigger issue.

And @ Jae Ran, guess what; If you have children, I will be there for them in 20 years as well.

Mei-Ling

Actually, it is this:

"By every indication, Chun-Soon Li is American. except for adoption at birth. She has only one family, also American, and by blood only, she has a link to a Korean woman who birthed her, but whom she has never met. And the gifts she brought from Korea to America are limited to her genetic make up, and her life."

Which has people criticising your responses. It is that paragraph which is making adoptive parents wonder how exactly you discuss adoption with your own children.

Kim

@Atlasien

"It must severely disturb similar racist troglodytes to hear that China has been increasing domestic adoption to the point where they’ll probably shut down international soon. But I guess they’ll always have their racist stereotypes to comfort themselves with."

First, thank you for your kind words.

Actually I already wrote about this very point several weeks ago at another post, guess you must have missed it.

But Atlasien, why are you apparently opposed to the official adoption policy of the People's Republic of China? I'm the guy who is advocating for it to continue. The CCAA in Beijing has for the last decade been the international model for orderly and fair adoption. It is one of the best examples of China's authoritarian, but ultimately far more humane (vis-a-vis India, for instance) system for placing orphans. You do understand, many here would like to end international adoption don't you?

Kim

@Paula ---

"As a fellow Korean adoptee as well as an AP of a son born in Korea, I am so happy to see yet another adoptee speaking her truth.'

Kind words indeed, Paula, but did you miss the political message that is central to Chun-Soon Li's Post? maybe you didn't read all her references: "Push to industrialize" Adoption from South Korea: Isn't 50 years ENOUGH?---

Are you sure she approves of your adopted son? Maybe its ok if he's just the last one... (I've got mine too---from China)

Kim

@Mei-Ling

In this forum particularly, (since there have been so many comments involving my children)---I'm not comfortable saying more about them, except that you need not worry. Its a matter of record here, that they are being raised to be both American and Chinese, and they are well adjusted.

I guess as you quote me my comment seem a little curt. But as I mentioned to Kristin, I do believe Chun-Soon Li's post is mostly a political tract (to end international adoption) and to be honest, when people cloak politics in emotional issues, I simply go straight to the politics.

John aka Jae-Yong

LOL...are people still arguing with this Kim person! I can’t even take this person seriously anymore. I’m thinking this is just a person that likes to get into random arguments on blogs/message boards. I doubt this person even is an adoptive parent. And if Kim is, haha, well good luck Kim with the Hot Mess Your Creating. Haha, oh and I won’t be looking for your future response! Haha!

BTW…PEOPLE PLEASE STOP COMMENTING/RESPONDING TO KIM AND LET’S FOCUS ON THE REAL STAR OF THIS POSTING, Chun-Soon Li.

Mei-Ling

Kim:

"I guess as you quote me my comment seem a little curt."

Then why make a comment about that?

"You have warm feelings for that woman, but you have never met her, and probably never will—so its all a fantasy." Writing down such a statement like that leads me - and likely some others here as well - that you dismiss the opinions of Korean adoptees simply because their mothers gave birth and then "disappeared"? That their Korean mothers are irrelevant to the state of international adoption simply because there is a stigma within Korean society about having to abandon a child?

I'm afraid I do not understand your response.

If you have adopted from China - likewise, where the Chinese mothers have to abandon and "disappear" out of the picture - based on what you yourself have written, why would we have reason to believe you treat your adopted children any differently than the way you have challenged Chun-Soon Li?

Truth be told, I do not know how you discuss adoption with your children. Maybe you speak to them differently about their adoptions than the way you have proceeded to belittle Chun-Soon.

But the way you have responded leads me - and again, likely some others on here as well - to believe that you are ready to dismiss any opinion that does not fall into line with your thinking - that adoptees have "... only one family, also American, and by blood only, she has a link to a Korean woman who birthed her, but whom she has never met."

How else did you expect people to interpret your response when you dictate to a Korean adoptee who *her* family is?

Margie

@Kim: Um, I think you need to have your glasses checked, because I'm not sure how you find a slur about your kids or your parenting in my comment.

I'll say it again: When you (or anyone) speaks to an adopted person as you have spoken to Chunsoon here, I see (meaning the image in my head) is of you (or anyone) speaking to MY kids that way.

You may be OK with people dissing your kids, but I'm not. So again I say zip it.

Courtney

Chun soon. I loved your post and congratulations on your name. I am an AP of a daughter from Korea. Kim I think that you are just an Internet troll who likes to hurt peoples feelings and that is sad, leave adoptees alone.
Courtney

mama d

Chun-Soon: This is a beautiful post. Hopefully, my children can be as gracious and eloquent when they come home to who they truly truly are.

CSLi

Wow. I'm humbled by these comments. Following this discussion has helped me wrap my head around the issues of adoption, both in my own personal story and in the larger sense, as an industry which attempts to address some very human needs. I want to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread. You've all (including Kim) helped me navigate through what is obviously a difficult, murky and emotional subject. My analysis of IA hasn't changed -- but it's deepened.

Kim, when I read your first and second comments, I wondered why you had such a personal and disrespectful response to what I wrote. The general perception of calling views with which you disagree "horse shit" is, well, that it's insulting. As for me, I don't mind if you call my argument (against Korea's adoption industry) unsound, so long as you present a compelling and factual COUNTER. Instead, you seem to agree with me on some basic points. The defensive tone in your first comment made me wonder why you took this road. Then it became clear: the subject of my critique, IA, is what enabled you to have two Chinese daughters.

I've thought for days about whether I want to even comment here again -- not because I'm hurt by your intimate questions, but because I don't want to violate your privacy. However, I do want to share some ideas that I have with you; maybe you'll appreciate them, maybe not.

I searched on youtube for adoptive parent videos, and got a lot of home videos that folks made of their new, adorable (asian) kids. The love the adoptive parents feel for these children is palpable and very touching. I also saw a few videos by adoption agencies used to advertise their services. If I was a prospective AP, what would sell me on a particular agency? Well, I'd want to see interviews with happy parents, happy adopted kids, that sort of thing. What struck me is how sincere the parents seem to be; they're overwhelmingly white, middle-class Americans, half of them moved to tears by the new addition to their lives, and every single one of them expressed Gratitude to the agency for allowing them to be parents. It's funny, I had never thought about adoption that way before, and had not thought of my parents in terms of their gratitude to ME. And why not? I was well-behaved, studious, and fairly low-maintenance. Here's where the adoption-as-industry answers my question: adoptees are required to be grateful, because it's a buyer's market. Adoptive parents can pick from thousands of children. If there were only a handful of orphans for every thousand couples looking to adopt, I wonder if people would expect the parents to be grateful, and express their gratitude in no uncertain terms.

Of course, we can do better than that, can't we Kim?

We both agree that the prospects for orphans, mostly girls, in countries like China and Korea are not good. We even agree on the reasons why this is so. Where we differ: I think these reasons need to be addressed and that these societies must change in their attitudes toward women and girls. I think that these sorts of changes, though slow, will occur, and that international adoption is just a band-aid that slows this process of change. Korean government: Why change our attitudes toward single moms, require deadbeat dads to support their children, or aid poor families when we can just funnel their offspring to the Western world? You probably think you are taking a more realistic, pragmatic approach. "There will always be orphans, they'll never be accepted into society, therefore IA will save them." That's where my post comes in. I'm calling out the conditions which led to my adoption. That is where the true change needs to happen.

You're right, I had a materially-sufficient upbringing in the little suburb I called home. But feeding and clothing a kid just aren't enough. Why do you think so many adoptees yearn for their biological parents? We feel CUT OFF from something important, from an essential part of ourselves. If you're not an adoptee, the best you can do is try to imagine what it might feel like.

I'm starting to believe that the adoption "triad" is actually more of a quad: you have the adoptee, the adoptive parents and the birth parents (usually mother), but you also have the agency/orphanage in Korea, working in conjunction with a church or agency in the West. Without any of these four points you cannot tell the story of adoption. oh, but wait -- there's also Adoption as gender bias writ large, and Adoption as an industry (because, honestly, if the goal was to "save the babies" but no money changed hands, guess how many orphanages and agencies would exist?). You know, I'm starting to believe that the adoption "triad" is really more of an octopus.

You said, "I view Chun-Soon Li’s original post...as something of an attempt to wrap her personal sense of loss around the political movement to end international adoption." -- ooh, that's a tough one. When someone levies a charge like that, I try to ask myself, "Could it be?" People do it all the time. When something is too painful to face, one might look to place blame where it hurts less. As in, "My mom loved me but was forced by society to give me up", as opposed to "My mom was irresponsible, selfish, hated me, wanted a boy, was a whore, thought I was ugly, etc." Here's the thing: When I am researching adoption in Korea, looking for knowledge and facts, I am led (by my American-educated good brain ;-) to the former conclusion. When I'm feeling insecure, sad, lonely -- I tumble into the latter modes of thinking. In fact, sometimes I can believe one while knowing the other. And hey, it can all be true. Maybe I'll never know. But since you're down the rabbit hole with me, Kim, have you ever wondered if perhaps your investment in adoption (a.k.a. your gratitude toward it for your daughters) has made it difficult for you to listen to adoptee's views that do not mirror yours? Could it be? I get the sense that you're a fiercely protective father who wants the best for his little girls, who deplores the conditions from which they came, and who sincerely wants other people like yourself to be given the same opportunity for joy that you have. Without prying into YOUR familial relationships, why would you fight to protect IA if it exists to perpetuate (by enabling) the conditions which led your girls to orphanages in the first place?

Do I want to see an end to international adoption? No. I want to see an end to the conditions and biases, the racism, sexism, marginalization of the poor, and other illnesses that create the reality of international adoption as it exists today. I close my eyes and imagine, Kim, that one day Korea will no longer have these attitudes and policies. There will still be orphans, but they will be rare and looked after. Do I think a childless couple in another country should be given the opportunity to adopt? If adoption were not made possible by so many of societies ills, yes. But I think we both agree...we've a long way to go.

Mei-Ling

"Then it became clear: the subject of my critique, IA, is what enabled you to have two Chinese daughters."

You know, Chun-Soon, that is exactly the question I meant to ask but forgot to address both times.

I mean, if an adoptee questions international adoption, in a way they're questioning their adoptive family's motives *and* original family's motives - which questions the foundation of family by adoption, which would lead to the perception of feeling as though your personal beliefs and views have been challenged, even imposed on, and that's where many of the adoptive parents get defensive.

After all, a lot of people only became families through adoption... and they see comments like this and take it personally because it confronts their fear that their family was based on a possibly faulty system that is being called out on.

Mei-Ling

ETA: Ignore the reference to Chun-Soon's name. I've been exhausted lately and realized in hindsight it was actually CSLI who wrote the comment to Kim. Sorry about that.

Mei-Ling

Wow, I'm rather idiotic tonight, aren't I? (CSLI is actually the author!) Sigh. It's been a long day. @_@

atlasien

@Kim: as much as you seem to enjoy using your daughters as rhetorical human shields for your insults and curses, you yourself, and no one else, are responsible for your own (racist) words. Don't make this about them, because it's about you.

Also, I'm not interested in making policy recommendations to the CCAA; I have not adopted from China nor do I intend to. I'm just happy that the trend in China towards increased domestic adoption means less international adoption, which I think should always be the last resort of last resorts. And then when international adoption hopefully slows to a trickle then stops, types like Kim will have to find some other way to tout their superiority over us inarticulate badly-educated feeding-live-children-to-dogs conservative Confucian Asians.

Sorry John aka Jae-Yong. Couldn't resist. I will from now on though, I promise.

CS LI, that was a very gracious and thoughtful response.

Taking it to a more abstract policy level, it's my opinion that international adoption has no effect at all on general child welfare. There are many countries with no international adoption at all... but they still have terrible track records with child welfare. I would venture to say that the majority of countries in the world have very small or zero international adoption. And the countries that do have a lot of international adoption aren't any better or worse. I just don't see the correlation, either positive or negative.

International adoption has a major effect (both good or bad) on some individual children and families. But beyond that, I don't think it's possible to draw conclusions about causation.

For example, Japan has almost zero international adoption. Korea has a lot. Both countries have a high standard of living and low birth rates. Is the status of single mothers and children in foster care and orphanages better in one country than the other? It's hard to say. Both have problems. The US has a lot of problems too, but of a different nature.

I agree that countries would be better off if they spent more money on child welfare, foster care, and encouraging a multi-pronged strategy of supporting unified families, then kinship adoption and guardianship, then domestic adoption. Some countries don't have these resources. Japan, Korea and the US, even China, all do really have the resources, they are just not prioritizing these needs.

As for your point about adoption as an octopus... I actually feel a strong sense of gratitude toward adoption, because my father is adopted (Asians in Asian countries do adopt other Asians, which is something the white savior types like to gloss over). Without adoption, my father wouldn't have survived, and I wouldn't have been born myself. But I totally separate this sense of adoption from the adoption industry and those who benefit from its worst excesses and consumerism. Adoption is my father's life being saved. Adoption is also kidnapping of babies from desperate parents amid widespread corruption. Adoption is the kindness of strangers (and the kindness and duty of the extended family). Adoption is a brutal racialized hierarchy where white babies are worth the most, older black children are worth the least and Asian babies are somewhere in the middle because they're deemed practically as good as white. Adoption is a lot of things, some good, some bad. I am certainly not going to worship it like an idol. It's horrifying to me that so many adoptees are forced to bow down before it...

Confuse_Us

CSLI wrote...
"I’ve thought for days about whether I want to even comment here again.......international adoption is just a band-aid that slows this process of change. Korean government: Why change our attitudes toward single moms, require deadbeat dads to support their children, or aid poor families when we can just funnel their offspring to the Western world?"

That really is an excellent point, it would seem that in the long run western adoption does not contribute to a better environment for orphans in Korea or improve attitides to single mums.

I'm glad that you decided to comment here again and hope you continue to do so. I laud your courage in being willing to continue to discuss a very personal and painful subject despite the pompous condescension of Kim's comments. Your exchanges with Kim have illustrated that for some, (hopefully a very few)who adopt Asian babies it's about self-aggrandizement more than anything. Thankfully, some have made comments here that may show that Kim is just a member of a self-righteous minority amongst white couples who adopt.

I'm not an adoptee, but my wife is. My wife is white and was adopted by a white couple, yet, she speaks of the same sense of feeling "cut-off" from something important. So, your experience as an adoptee is 100% valid and appropriate and is common across racial and cultural boundaries. Of course, being of Asian descent may complicate the issue further, but all Asians that grew up in the west may well share your feelings of being cut-off and in a sense that may make all of us "orphans".

Again, thanks for this thread and I hope you continue to post on this subject.

yoonsblur

http://yoonsblur.blogspot.com/2009/04/one-and-m...

Some may (or may not...smile, wink) want to check out the web address above. It addresses some of the issues being discussed in this forum. It was written independently, or in other words, without knowledge of the pertaining post by Chun Soon (deepest thanks, Chun Soon). But a fellow adoptee (thanks, Kristin!) informed me of this discussion, and that the issues being contemplated were very similar to what I had posted to my blog...And indeed they are!

Just a disclaimer, though--although I am a 33-year old (almost 34) Korean adoptee, I am relatively new to the "adoption community" itself. It is only within recent years that I have begun to ponder more deeply my own adoption experience as well as connect with other adoptees, adoptive parents, etc. ...I find forums like this and the complex issues surrounding adoption rather intimidating and overwhelming, and as of yet, still remain unresolved and open on most issues. My main hope and desire at this point is to connect with others by attempting to share my thoughts and emotions.

I have learned a great deal just by reading Chun Soon's post and the corresponding discussion. I realize I still have much to learn and contemplate!

S.

Thank you for this post. We chose to retain our daughter's first and middle names given by the orphanage director and to add an American name at the beginning, thinking that would give her the option to use her Vietnamese name if she chooses in the future. I appreciate your taking the time to share your feelings and experiences and I pray it will make me a better parent to my daughter.

Ed

Thanks for sharing such an intimate part of your life. As an adoptive parent of two Korean sons, I place great value on what you think.

We went back and forth as to naming our sons and ended up giving them western names followed by their Korean names. This of course gives them rather long names, but I hope they will see that we mean to attempt to not obliterate their Korean identities.

Were they to decide to change their names later on I would be perfectly fine with it. I try to focus on my role as an adoptive parent and not on any expectations beyond giving them the best start that I can. I'm of the school that says children don't owe their parents anything but to make the best of their lives.

I also believe naming a person with a nickname is a privilege one can grant, but by default we should call a person what they wish.

Kim

I’m sure that many will applaud to learn that this is my final post at 8Asians.

I know there are significant issues that most adoptees faces at some point in her life regarding the loss of birth family. Issues which run deeper and harder to the spiritual core for some than others. I have never denied that, and how could I? The co-collision of loss and orphanage experience were manifest not only in behavior, but right down the souls of my own daughters---from the moment they were handed to me, separately and some years apart. It would seem so obvious, (and it is, to those who have adopted older orphanage children) ---that I thought for sure, it would need no further explanation ( inference or interference) from Chun-Soon Li or her supporters. Not true, unfortunately.

Also, I happen to believe that adoption is, and should be, a matter of last resort, and that ideally, when it it occurs, its always best if it occurs in the country and culture of the child’s birth. (I’m on record at a different post applauding the fact that more Chinese are stepping up to adopt girls).

And btw, if there are any here who, after reading Chun-Soon Li’s cynical original post might still consider international adoption----TRUST ME: YOU ARE ON THE SIDE OF THE ANGELS! also, it would be one of the most enjoyable and challenging experiences of your life---memories from which fill you with joy, and poignancy. So please, do it if you can.

A reoccurring theme here is that I don’t understand the perspective of the adoptee. But Chun-soon Li, you and those supporting this HS movement seem so entirely clueless to the perspective of the offshore orphans as they exist (as opposed to thrive) in the orphanages.

And as I mentioned, it seems to take an academic to elevate all grievances (Chun-Soon Li’s personal sense of loss) to a level equal with the plight of those in the orphanages. References to Chun-Soon Li’s original post document infanticide in Korea for gender selection purposes, just as I did for China. Why that didn’t become a broader discussion, only Chun-Soon Li knows..

The institutionalized orphans (China) are the lucky ones. Think of all the others, downstream, who never make it from street abandonment into an orphanage, or who become traded, or sold, possibilities for exploitation similar to that shown in SlumdogMillionare. Fortunately, some large percentage are now being traded and sold into homes, later to become wives, in rural areas short of girls.

In international adoption China is different from most countries. There are no orphans sold into the process. Its against the law in China to abandon your children, thus they are left anonymously, perhaps with a small note. And indeed, authorities will look for the parents, and occasionally find and punish them, encouraging an even more clandestine process. The China Center for Adoption Affairs in Beijing has, in the last decade been widely recognized as the “Gold Standard” for efficient and fair placement of orphans. No children are place at the local level---Zero. So there is no chance for under-the-table graft. CCAA has a profile on every child in every sanctioned orphanage in China. And from those profiles children are matched to the profiles of perspective parents. Anyone attempting to open an unsanctioned orphanage faces serious criminal charges. There is virtually no chance of exiting China with a child who has not been adopted through the CCAA. In fact, when I’m traveling with my daughters in China, I always warn people behind me in the exit line, that we will probably be delayed, as the PRC officer checks not only visa and passports, but what seems like every provincial data base for recent baby trafficking.

Westerners, at least, don’t get to select children, or provide parameters, other than age and gender, (if you want a boy, its usually one with fairly minor physical challenges, such as cleft lip). For daughter # 2 we were successful in requesting a girl who’s first language was Mandarin, since it was the language of #1. The US State Department recognizes that what I have said here about adoption is China is factually correct.

Chun-Soon Li asks: “Kim have you ever wondered if perhaps your investment in adoption (a.k.a your gratitude toward it for your daughters) has made it difficult for you to listen to adoptee’s views that do not mirror yours?”

No, I don’t, Chun-Soon Li, because against the reality of the orphanage, logic dictates that your reality is not a consideration. Or to put it another way---its not about you, Chun-Soon Li. When western parents go to China to adopt, its only after years of preparation---and anticipation. In the final month or so, they have a picture of their child, and its amazing how you can bond with a 1” square picture, But upon arrival, there is the usual sensory overload that is China, (many experiencing it for the first time). And nothing prepares for receiving the child. With all of the ensuing joy, something else fairly quickly becomes evident. Something very similar to “survivors remorse” ---its well known, and almost universal among adopting parents, and its why many who thought they were only in the process for one child, ultimately return again. You see, Chun-Soon Li, if you meet your daughter’s orphanage friends (or partners in crime), or perhaps worse, you see, or become aware that the selection of your baby is from a sea of babies in a crowded room, you experience the humanity, the empathy and a huge sense of sorrow for leaving the others behind. The ones coming out (like you and my girls) are the lucky ones. There is an organization of Chinese adoption parents called: “Half the Sky” who return time and again to perform good works, sort of like “Habitat for Humanity”, in orphanages throughout China.

As to the orphanage, you are also possessed with an immediate sense of urgency---which is why I find support for your position so confounding: You have a supporter who knows that time is of the extreme essence in the developing young brain, yet here is this sea of babies getting material nourishment, but not developmental, and often with very limited physical contact. You have another supporter who has been through the process in Korea---in the face of these immediate, and practical needs, how can she endorse your long term, vaguely and naively considered political efforts to end adoption? To me, its immoral.

---”why would you fight to protect IA if it exists to perpetuate (by enabling) the conditions which led your girls to the orphanages in the first place?” The answer is because it doesn’t---it allows them to exist, after they have been abandoned---yes, Chun-soon Li----by their parents NOT the State---the State does everything it can to enforce parenting in China, not to pull families apart for your fantasy of greedy capitalism. And China does that where infanticide remains a threat, although as the value (including monetary value) of girls increases, hopefully that will soon be a crime of the past.

You know, Chun-Soon Li, I note that you are an artist, and trained as such. Me too. But my MFA has done nothing to train me for the reality of China. For that its taken years of work and time in China. And its been a life changer to marry into a Chinese family as well. I’m not sure how that combination works, exactly except I do think I have transformed from a liberal to a mostly conservative point of view. Before, I never cared much about the concept of extended family--I do now in China. When ever I return, I still spend all my time learning about the culture, and the Country is evolving so fast, its somewhat disorienting. But over all the years I visited China, I never once assumed that I should have a role in CHANGING China.

And that, Chun-Soon Li, is what makes you, and this HS movement so thoroughly American in my eyes. You have the audacity to take, not even a subtle---but rather, a frontal assault---think “Shock and Awe”---to Korea---seeking to change social policy regarding the status of women. ?---that single mothers, who may have exhusted emotional and financial resources don’t have the option of adoption for their babies? Well now, there’s a formula for infanticide. You also want to end prostitution? You live in New York---Chun-Soon Li, ---got the prostitution problem solved there yet? As progressive as Portland is, there are still plenty of prostitutes working the streets not far from my house.

In Portland, my wife has what I consider the uncanny ability to pick ABC’s even before they speak, she can pick Native Chinese the same way. Do you suppose that when you visit Korea that you have some special currency as a Korean adoptee? Do you suppose your Asian features earn Korean cultural respect? And if the women in Korea, are as subjugated as you say, do you believe you have more political credibility, speak with more moral authority---or less? And here’s a hint: if you think its more, then you are guilty of cultural grandiosity, and attempting to impose western privilege.

When Korean adoptees assemble in Korea, of course, there are apologies all around, if its like China, and on this point I suspect it is---they are extending to you an opportunity to save face. And even if you double your numbers next time, to 1500, the elephant in the room in the minds of most Korean will still be: 1500 dissatisfied orphans out of 150,000 ---where is the other 99%?

You and the followers of this HS movement must have missed the memo: This century is the century of conservative, and in family matters, structured Confucian Asia, particularly China, not the chaotic liberal family of the west. In China, the western family model is lost. Its failed. Its over.

Neither Korea or China is interested in “empowering” single motherhood, and the chaos that brings into children’s lives. In fact, in those years when the US State Department presents its preachy “Human Rights Assessment” about China, one of the arguments China often uses in its push-back is the chaos of the American family, and how that can deny human rights to America’s children---a valid point.

My wife translates the love I have for my daughters as “big love” I think its one of the things she found appealing about me. But its not the same as “family love” implicitly linked to family obligation. And as much as my family loves and respects me, they, like most Chinese, aren't really into “big love” when it comes to family matters.

And since my family includes several Party members, let me present here an ‘advanced copy’ of social policy coming down the pike: The time of tolerance for western liberal social “missionaries” is coming to an end in China. And as that does, we also know the liberal western media is going to propagandize that as “China’s New Nationalism” New York Times: (pix of Chinese children in school uniforms---doing some organized activity): “CHINA: NATIONALISM’S NEW GRIP” Newsweek: (red cover, gold lettering, a line of several identical Chinese solders braced at attention against the red background): CHINA’S NEW NATIONALISM: A THREAT TO THE US?” --you can take this to the bank...

And that brings me to Chun-soon Li’s impeccably crafted piece of propaganda. So perfect that only I object, apparently---(and yes, I most certainly am considering that its just me---not her, or her supporters---one reason for bailing out of 8Asians). I’ll be blunt. Its my opinion that Chun-Soon Li is using her adoptee victim status as a marketing tool for her artistic career. From personal experience, I know how hard it can be in places like L.A. and New York to get recognized as an artist, and particularly, a SERIOUS artist dealing with serious matters: “the struggle of the powerless to free themselves” And her victimhood serves both as her shtick, and her certification of validity.

Before I sign off, I would be remiss if I didn’t give one big ‘shout out’ to Atlasien---without who’s comic relief here, this might have been a whole lot more serious.

Mei-Ling

"You have the audacity to take, not even a subtle—but rather, a frontal assault—think “Shock and Awe”—to Korea—seeking to change social policy regarding the status of women. ?—that single mothers, who may have exhusted emotional and financial resources don’t have the option of adoption for their babies?"

Actually, there ARE Korean adoptees attempting to change that and formulate social services and support centres for stigmatized women in Korea.

See here: http://harlowmonkey.typepad.com/

kristin

Kim-

We thank you for making this your last post. Clearly the voices of the adult adoptees in this forum mean nothing to you. Like so many of us, Chun Soon and I are merely trying to make sense of the last 30+ years of our lives. We have not had the benefit of hearing from those who came before and are just now coming to terms with our realities. The only voices we have heard over the last 50 years has been from APs. It is now our turn to speak, like it or not.

Confuse_Us

Kim.....

"I’m sure that many will applaud to learn that this is my final post at 8Asians."

Some may just laugh.

mama d

... others may simply go wash that little bit of throw up out of their mouths.

atlasien

As we say down here in Georgia, don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya!

DilatedPeoples

My observation: Chun-Soon Li has knowledge and humility. Kim is uncouth and mean-spirited. It's pretty clear who has elevated the discussion and who has degraded himself to the gutter.

Chun-Soon, keep your head held high: you've become a shining voice for the once-voiceless.
But beware, there will be people like Kim crawling around the proverbial woodwork, so make sure your armor has Teflon.

One Love!

Jen

Congratulations on your name change- thank you for sharing it with us.

I anticipate one of my dd's deciding to do this someday. We discuss it with our kids often in the hope that they will feel comfortable to use either of their names and have confidence that we would support their choice.

Choosing how to handle naming my dd's was like navigating a minefield. They each came with unique challenges that our not mine to share. We had chosen names for our first child, fifteen years prior to our first adoption. We felt that naming our dd anything else would be to treat her as "less than" our daughter. We named her that silly romantic name we chose as teenage sweethearts to embrace her, it was our promise to her.

We could never have imagined where the journey parenting her would take us. No amount of education and reading prepared me for the things this child would teach me. I could not have predicted how it would spin us on our ear and give us an entirely different view of adoption.

If her eight year old self had a blog to post on , today she'd say- "Who is responsible for sending me away? Who decided I should leave my home, China? Orphan or not, it was not their right."

If anyone is looking for gratitude out of my kids, they're gonna be disappointed.

Mei-Ling

"Who is responsible for sending me away? Who decided I should leave my home, China? Orphan or not, it was not their right.”

Without saying this the wrong way, I really look forward to the day that your child might start blogging, because that statement is brilliant.

Sharie

Chun-Soon Li,
Thank you for sharing your honest unedited feelings with the world. I am the adoptive mother to a daughter born in China - at 4 1/2 I can already tell how hard growing up away from where she was born is going to be for her. She asks constantly of her first parents - she asks to meet them and when I tell her I don't know who they are she says I should ask them their names. SHE asked to learn to speak Chinese. She longs to keep her heritage a part of her.
I have a HUGE job ahead to help her to feel whole. Reading your feelings as well as those of other adoptees will only assist me. THANK YOU!

yoonsblur

http://joongangdaily.joins.com/article/view.asp...

If you have not stumbled across this article already--it was just posted on April 1, a few days ago. It discusses the unique financial, social, and political issues alluded to in this forum, that single/unwed mothers face in Korea.

Daniel W.

After reading these comments, I had no idea it would have escalated in such a manner. As much as a lot other commentators hate it, I personally hope Kim can come back and contribute some of his knowledge to this website...a lot of it is very informative and credible. Maybe in this particular topic, it went a bit too personal and produce some feelings of misunderstanding.

I don't know much and still have a hard time understanding adoptees or adoptive parents, despite interacting with people of that background for some time. I'm aware that the love is there, the confusion is there, the struggles and warmth are there too...and this applies beyond race,ethnicity,culture, nationality,etc.

I don't know how many people believe in religious/spirituality matters, but according to some beliefs, names do have a metaphysical properties/almost superstitious elements to them. The reason why I brought that up is that this story, whatever the real reason(s) may be, reminds me of stories I heard where individuals who also made their journey of self-discovery and "reverted" back to their supposed original identity. It also involved adoptees or adults who discovered they were adopted, thought something was missing and made that journey. Some went ahead to change their names and even demographic identity. According to some beliefs, the birth mother leaves an enternal mark on the soul of her offspring due to the need to carry that child for a period of time. The mother's identity will always be embedded in the child's conscience.

Of course, whatever you all want to believe is up to the individuals. A rational viewpoint is that American society has a lot of work to do in terms of demographic issues. Every society does in some way. The desire to find your roots (even if it's a bit too rosy for reality) is quite strong for many people in this constantly changing environment with a realitively short history. Provides a sense of security for some. Added with another strong urge to feel special and create a "name" for oneself. Then there's the issue how some feel that their outsiders in their own homes. Feeling lonely even with many people around. So many factors along with whatever personal issues unique to the individual's life.

Overall, a lot to think about and thanks for Chun-soon Li and all the other adoptees, adoptive parents and other commentators for such an interesting topic.

Daniel W.

I wanted to follow up a bit from my previous comment. There's also family/social pressure along with the many other reasons I listed which affect topics such as this one. However the family/social pressure factor is pretty much a handful itself. There's already so many things to worry about and do, let alone self-identity crisis, which is just as important.

IMHO, I'm not too fond of people using the statements of how things were a lot worst before or it could have been worst...like don't use it too casually. Sort of how our elders nag how the younger people have it so much better than before, more food to eat, luxury,better opportunities, education, etc. That is definantly true and we, the descendents should offer gratitude for the forbearers who pave such a path. However, I'm afraid if these quotes or statements gets thrown around too much, it sort of loses its meaning. People become a bit turn off when nagged too much. Every generation has it's own unique challenges. There's little need to push such statements on the young, unless there is an real lesson involved. It might end up limiting their potential rather than actualizing it. This is just a suggestion.

However, it would be the best to let parents/family (adopted or not)raise their kids in whatever they know best. There's no business for outsiders to interfere and most people understand the need for this boundary.

Lori

Kim - I don't know whether you are still reading.

I do not agree with your assessment of Chun Soon-li's writing here. But I am interested to see your other comments. You mention that you are "on record" here and there. Please could you post a link or way of searching for these? I am interested in your perspective as spouse of a Chinese person and adoptive parent to a Chinese child. Perhaps there is more common ground than would be thought from the interactions here. If you do not want to post maybe you can create a temporary gmail or yahoo mail account then post that here. Here is mine -- LLLoritemporary gmail dot com

I think there is value in hearing all sides.

MA

I am late getting this but I did want to applaud your courage, Chun-Soon Li to take care of yourself. You ARE Korean, and I am highly offended by the person who said you came over with nothing but your genetics, as if that means you are not "real." Who you are is not something you can wash off. My daughter is Chinese and she is growing up here in the US in a close knit Chinese community. She spends at least 2 hrs most days of the week with Chinese people and on the weekends almost all day. She gets the food, language, customs, discipline, dance. Yes, my daughter misses her birth parents and has a lot of angst about that (just like any adoptee would- it is a HUGE loss), but to say she cannot grow up Chinese because she was adopted? That is insane. I am glad you are embracing your heritage! Who has a right to tell you how you should keep and nurture your own culture in yourself. No one. Good for you!

btstormb2006

Chun-Soon

Congratulations on YOUR decision to change your legal name! I think that as KADs we may share common threads, but equally important is our ability to have our own sense of self. Adoption experiences cannot always be lumped together, because we are individuals. No matter who says it to you, realize that you ALONE have the ability and the right to make decisions, which you feel are best for you. In turn, those who are not threatened or intimidated by you or your actions, will fully support you. Experience has shown me, no matter where you are (workplace, family, public places, etc), if someone is rude, belligerent or abusive, it is highly likely it is NOT about you, but rather that person and their own insecurities. You can only control what you do in life, and cannot control other people's responses. Kudos to you for taking a step towards your own personal healing! I wish you much continued peace and understanding throughout your journey!

Allan

Great post. Very thought-provoking. Now that you've changed your name, what will you do to change the way things are?

choidog

@CSLi Well done! I was very impressed with your thoughtful response to "Kim". We've been silenced for two and half generations because of mindsets like Kim's. It's time for us to take our rightful place in the reconstruction of the Adoption machine.

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